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Episode 6 - Inter-generational /transactional sex

Young women often get involved in relationships with older men and because of the expensive gifts or social status that comes with the relationship. This is called Intergenerational/Transactional sex. Women often experience pressure from families to find a man who could support them financially, and this pressure can lead to them becoming involved with men who will support them in various ways. It can become a way of life: to go in search of much older men who will give basic things like rice and meat in exchange for sex.

Shalom Ncala: [Sanibonani siyanamukela nonke ehlelweni i-Siyayinqoba Beat It!, lolu hlelo elawo wonke umuntu wase Ningizim Afrika ofuna nokubhekana nokunqoba izintselela zesifo ngculaza kanye nesandulela ngculaza. Namhlanje sizogxoxha ngochantsi phakathi kwamantombazana esemahle noma-intsa kanye nabesilisa abadala. Sanibonani kuni nonke] [IsiZulu] Hello and welcome to Siyayinqona Beat It! This is the programme for everyone in South Africa meeting and beating the challenges of HIV and AIDS. Today we are discussing sex between younger women and older men. Hello everybody

Support group: Hello Shalom

Shalom: Siyajabula ukuba naye Luckyboy nawe Nokubonga(IsiZulu)[We also have Luckyboy and Nokubonga joining us today. ]

Luckyboy: Siyavuya nathi ukuba lapha sisi.(IsiZulu) [We're happy to be here, thanks]

Shalom: [Amantombazana amaningi athandana namadoda amadala kunawo ngoba lokhu kuphakamisa igama labo emphakathini futhi athola izifumbathiso noma izipho ezithile. Kulo hlobo lothando lamantombazana azithola esebeka izimpilo zabo ubuchayini ngoba agcina engasakwazi ukuba nochantsi olufikelekile. Yingakho nje kwezi zintsuku sinesibalo esikhulu samantombazana anesifo sengculaza. Ake sivakashele e-Khayelitsha ngodaba lewthu lokuqala namhlanje.] (IsiZulu) Many young women get into relationships with older men because they can offer social status and gifts. These relationships often mean that the young girls put themselves at risk because the are unable to insist on using condoms. This is why we see so many young women testing HIV positive. Let's go to Khayelitsha for our first story today.

Luvuyo Nibe: Molweni babukeli emakhaya. Namhlanje sise Site C e-Khayelitsha. Sithetha no sis'Nonelwa Tetafuthi nge transactional sex. Masambeni siyoveni. [isiXhosa] Hello viewers, today we're in Site C, Khayelitsha. We're talking to Nonelwa Tetafuthi about transactional sex. Let's meet her.

Nonelwa Tetafuthi: Ukuqala kwam ukufunda ndifunde eVuzamanzi ndayoku funda eSikhokhelo. Ukuphuma kwam eSikhokhelo ndiye ndayofunda eFezeka. Kulapho ubomi baqala batsintsa andamamela. Apha ekhaya kwathiwa since ndingamameli izandla ziyahlanjwa. Zahlanjwa izandla kwathiwa ndimdala mandizibonele. Okay ke lihambile ithuba ndatshintsa kengoku kwafikelela kwistage soba mandijole. Ndane O ekwakuthiwa ngu Fish. Ufish wayengathandwa ekhaya, yayengaphangeli. Ndixelele ke yeyiphi indoda engamnikiyo umntu imali, ndifuna ntoni kwindoda engaphangeliyo. Kwakufuneka ndize nemali ndibe nenyama ndibe nerice, ibirice ikhona lonto ndizanayo ephathekayo ndingathi umgena ndlini. Ufish ndandimthanda then engaphangeliyo then andinakuzifumana ezo zinto. Ndaqonda lendiyihlalayo intlalo yeyona intlalo ibuhlungu makhe ndihambe ndiyozifunela umntu one mali. Ndathi ndihamba ngenye imini ndadibana nomntu ongu bhuti eqhuba imoto, ngumntu ongu bhuti mdala. Ndongcokola naye.So since then nda jola naloo bhuti. Kwatsho kwalandela nabanye. Ndatsho ndabuqhela ubomi ndakwazi ukuba imali iyafunwa endodeni. Ukuba iyinamali mandiyishiye. Ewe bendilala nabantu abadala kakhulu abanye. Abanye ufumanise ukuba umdala nge 20 years. Ndibe ndiqhonda andinaxesha lalonto ndifuna imali qha. Babe ndinxibisa shame ndandisitya kamnandi. Ndiphuma ndisbheke koma restaurant ndihlale nditye, ndiphume ndithathwe ndisiwe koma clubbini. Andiyazi ukuba ndizakuyibeka njani. Ndandisi felisha ndiphila ubomi obumnandi whether ndinga phangeli. But kodwa imali ndinayo yonke into ndinayo. Ndandibanayo amadoda more than 15 kwinyanga eyi-one. Kwakunyanzelekile ndilale nabo ngoba emjolweni kuyalalwa xa abantu bethandana. [IsiXhosa] I went to Vuzamanzi Primary, then to Sikhokhelo Primary. From there I went to Fezeka High. That's when my life changed. I was very rebellious. At home they wanted to do nothing with me because I was so naughty. They said I was old enough to fend for myself. Time went by and I got to a stage when I was old enough to start dating. I had a boyfriend called Fish. At home they hated fish because he didn't have a job. They said what kind of man doesn't give his girlfriend money. What am doing with an unemployed man. I had to bring home money and meat. Or even rice, anything, just as long as I didn't come home empty-handed. I loved Fish, but he didn't have a job. So I couldn't get these things to bring back home. I didn't like the way my life was so I went out in search of a rich man. So one day I met an older guy driving a car. I spoke to him and I ended up dating this older guy. Lots more followed and I got used to the life of asking a man for money. If he didn't have money, I'd just dump him. I slept with very old men. Some were even 20 years older than me 20. The age gaps didn't matter, I just wanted money. They bought me clothes and I ate nice food. They took me out to fancy restaurants and clubs. I don't know how to describe the feeling. I was living a life of luxury even though I didn't have a job. I had money and everything. I would have about 15 boyfriends at the same time. And I had to sleep with them because sex is part of any relationship.

Vuyo: So icondom wawuyisebenzisa? [IsiXhosa] Did you use condoms ?

Nonelwa: Icondom bhuti ndandiyisebenzisa kwabanye kwabanye ndingayisebenzisi. Ndndingena xesha lalento kuthiwa yi condom, ndandimbona nje omnye umntu eyisebenzisa icondom ndandingab endibuza ba why usebenzisa icondom why ungayisebenzisi. Ndandibona kwanto ndingena xesha layo, ndingenayo ne information yecondom yoba isetyenziswa xa kutheni. Ndiyambile ke ndaya eyouth ukufika kwam e youth ndafumaniseka ukuba ndi-positive. Okay ke njengoko ndandinabantu abaninzi sondazixelela ukuba andinakuthi ndisulelwe ngubani ndingenokuthi ngubani. So ke andiyazi. [IsiXhosa] I used condoms with some and with others I didn't. I didn't care much about that, I just saw some use it. I didn't ask why, I just saw this condom things. I didn't know even know what a condom was used for. Then I went to the youth center and I tested HIV positive. Since I had slept around with so many guys, I couldn't really know who infected me. I just don't know.

Busi Maqungu: Am very much impress yindlela uNonelwa a-open and honest ngayo. Because if you look at it ayongxaki eyenzeka kuNonelwa yedwa leyana. Yinto eyenzeka kubantu abaninzi but abahla nayo bangathethi ngayo si act as if izinto are different while they are not. And enye into endiyiqhapheleyo ngaye was that isuke iskakhulu ngase bazalini. Yipressure esuke ebazalini ukuze abe ukhokhelela kulanto. Am just impressed I don't know. [IsiXhosa] I'm very much impress with the way Nonelwa is open and honest because if we look at it, this happens a lot in our communities, but other people tend to keep quiet and act as if things are different when they are not. Another thing I picked up is that she was under pressure by her parents. Pressure from the parents pushed her into all this.

Luckyboy Mkhondwane: It was due from ipressure from Ekhaya because she would be asked am questions okuthi yindoda enjani engaphani imali. And then wathi umase eqalile ukuyenza lonto leyo wabona ukuthi ubanaba benefits ekuthini ehambe athandane nabamntu abadala kuyena abazothi bamphe imali. Aand in the end kwacina iyinto ayenzayo because she saw ama-advantages akhona ukuthi iyamsebenzela lento le. Atleast uyanikela ngako oko anikela ngakho and then she gets something. [IsiZulu] It was due to pressure from home because she'd be asked questions like what is she doing with an unemployed man. And then once she started doing what she was doing, she saw the benefits of having an older man that can give her money. She started doing it more often because she saw the advantages. She gave them something and she got something back.

Shalom: And futhi enye into bebe disownile already so bengakho any other means of support azoyithola except for loya mgena ndlini azowuthola njeba akhuluma ngawo. [IsiZulu] Her parents had disowned her so there was no means of support except for when she brought something home.

Nokubonga Yawa: Ndingathi okokuqala usis' Nonelwa loo Fish wakhe lo wayethandana naye waye kwi age enye naye but the uye wanyanzeleka into yobana athandane nalo umdala umntu ngenxeni yezinto ezi pusher makathandane nalo umdala. Then ufika kulamntu umdala ngengoku nake, lamntu umdala une experience eninzi qhithi kudala wathandana lamntu. Uyayazi ukuqhatha umntu ongusisi uthini xa ungafuniyo ukusebanzisa icondom naye and lamntu ebehambe elala nabantu ababengasebenzisi zicondoms. So i-sexual history uyayinqonda into yokuba une infections ezininzi azifumeneyo kwbantu ebethandana nabo. And then uya kulamntwana umncinci kengoku nake eyothandana naye ufika kuye akafuni ukusebenzisa icondom ngenxa yokuba ekuphelekeni uzakumnika imali ekuqhibeleni uzakumthengela imphahla, uzakumthengela iperfume uzakumthengela izinto ezimnandi [IsiXhosa] Firstly, her first boyfriend Fish was the same age as she was, then circumstance pushed her into the hands of an older man. Now the older guy has loads of experience, he's been around a lot. He knows how to trick a young girl into using a condom. This older guy may have been sleeping around without using condoms, his sexual history may include infections contracted from all those partners. He goes back to this young girl and he doesn't want to use a condom just because he's going to give her some money, buy hair clothes, nice perfumes and everything.

Busi: But wena Nokubonga nanje ngomntu omncinci do you think ukuba umntu omtsha xa ekwi relationship nomntu omdala akhona amathuba kube kuthethwa ngezinto ze condoms okanye i-safe sex and staff. [IsiXhosa] But Nokubonga, as a young person do you think that these relationships with older men allows one the space to negotiate condom use or safe sex.?

Nokubonga: Okokuqala i-culture kuthi ine ndim eyidlalayo kuba xana ungumntu omncinci owunokuthetha izinto ze sex nomntu omdala. Umzekelo ndenze umzekelo ngam mna ndiye ndiyendathandana ne boyfriend yam yokuqala ibingandala kakhulu kum but ke ibindala kuba kuthiwa moss kufuneka ibe ndala kunawe. But le yesibini ndiyendathandana nayo utata womntwana wam ibindala yona kunam. Wayena 25 mna ndina 14 years. Bebukhona ubunzima bobana izinto ezininzi sizithethe ukubone kuba umdala kunam and ekuqhibeleni nguye ondipha imali, nguye uyenzayo ukuba mandibe mhle ndikwazi uku relexer ndikwazi ukuthi ndithenge izinto zokuthanbisa ndikwazi ukunuka kamnandi njengawo amanye ama cherry onke. So akukho lula nxana ungumntu omncinci u discusser izinto ze condoms nomntu omdala kunawe. [IsiXhosa] I'd say culture plays a quite a role in this because a young person is generally not expected to talk about sex with elders. Let me use myself as an example. My first boyfriend was a bit older than me, not too old, but my second one, the father of my child, was quite older than me. He was 25 years old and I was 14. There were difficulties in talking about certain things because he was older than me and he gave me money. He was the reason I did my hair and looked beautiful, the reason I could buy myself toiletries like all the other girls. So discussing the use of condoms with an older partner is not easy.

Busi: But did you ever think of izinto ezinje nge HIV ne unwanted pregnancy as you ended up with unwanted pregnancy. Beacsue I am sure wawungafuni mntwana at 14. [IsiXhosa] But did you ever think of HIV and unwanted pregnancy as you ended up with one? Because I'm sure you didn't want to have a baby at 14.

Nokubonga: Into eyenzekayo wena sisi Busi eyona nto siyoyika kakhulu thina bantu bango sisi soyika ukumitha more than i-HIV. Umzekelo ukuba ndingalala nomntu ndingasebenzisanga condom ngomso into yokuqala endinovuka ndiyoyenza yi pregnancy test. Andizo gcinga nge HIV test iHIV test ndizakuyibona mva. Siya zi distance kwi HIV as if siphila kwenye iplanet engeyiyo le ine HIV. Uzigcingela ukuba wena uwunoba nayo iHIV. IHIV yeyo Nokubonga bodwa bona bona bantu banayo bathetha ngayo. Then if u-informed kulapho apho uzixelela no bubomi bam kumele ndithathe uxhanduva ngabo then ukuze ndingayi fumani iHIV, STIs ipregnancy kumele ndisticker ekusebenzeseni icondoms. [IsiXhosa] The thing is, the one thing many young girls fear most is falling pregnant more than HIV. For example, if I were to have unprotected sex with some guy tonight, the first thing I'd do tomorrow would be a pregnancy test. I wouldn't even think about an HIV test that'd be something for later. We tend to distance ourselves from HIV as if we're living on some planet that doesn't have HIV. You think that you can't have HIV, HIV is a disease for Nokubonga and others that have it and talk about it. Then once you're informed, you start to think this is my life and I have to tale responsibility for it. And for me not to get STIs, HIV and unwanted pregnancy I have to stick to using condoms.

Shalom: Unganyakazi siyabuya ngomzuzwana [IsiZulu] Stay where you are, we'll be back in a minute

Shalom: Siyakwamkela futhi ku Siyayinqoba Beat It! Udaba lwethu olulandelayo luqhambuka eRhawuthini masibone [IsiZulu] Welcome back to Siyayinqoba Beat It! Our next story is from Gauten g, let's check it out.

Mxolisi Mgobhoza: Siyi Siyayinqona sise Soshanguve sizothetha no bhuthi oma 32 years otshatileyo othandana nomtana ona 21 years . Mayi yova ukuba kutheni yintoni ebangela ukuba athandane nalo mntwana. [IsiZulu] Siyayinqoba is here in Soshanguve to talk to a 32 year old, married man who is involve with a 21 year old girl. Let's hear why he is involved with a girl so much younger than him.

Mxolisi: Akana nkinga ngendaba ye age phakathi kwakhe naye? [IsiZulu] Does she not have a problem with the age difference?

Man: Akazange abe ne problem angizange ngim fihlele ukuthi ngim dala kuye so indaba ye age azange ibe yinkinga at all. [IsiZulu] I've never kept it as a secret that I'm older than her, so no, age is not a problem at all.

Mxolisi: Utshatile?[IsiZulu] Are you married?

Man: Ja ngitshatile [IsiZulu] Yes I am married.

Mxolisi: Sicela usi tsele ukuthi unkosikazi wakho uyayazi lendaba yenzekayo phakathi kwakho no sisi lo usecaleni? [IsiZulu] Does your wife know about your relationship with this girl?

Man: Inkosikazi yam iyazi [IsiZulu] My wife knows about our relationship.

Mxolisi : Ingaba lomtwana uthandana naye uyasazi istatus sakho? [IsiZulu] Does this girl know about your status?

Man: Uyasazi istatus sam ukuthi ngi HIV positive. And then it's a long time ngiphila ngalo kugula. [IsiZulu] Yes she knows that I'm HIV positive. I've been living with the disease for long time.

Mxolisi: Umntana lo uthandana naye uyasazi istatus sakhe? [IsiZulu] Do you know her status?

Man: Angisazi istatus sakhe that's why I always protect her ngisebenzisa icondom. If bengingafuni ukusebenzisa icondom yes ebezakuvuma singayisebenzisi. [IsiZulu] I don't know her status, that's why I protect her by using a condom. If I didn't want to use a condom, she would let me.

Mxolisi: Wa reactor njani mawumtsela ukuthi uHIV positive zange asabe maybe nawe uzakumnikezela nge gciwani? [IsiZulu] How did she react when you told her you are HIV positive? Was she not afraid of being infected with the virus?

Man: Azange abe ne problem to be honest. Ukuthi lomntwana the way angithanda ngakhona I think undithanda the way kungakhona ne status sam all the way. [IsiZulu] She has no problem, to be honest. She loves me the way I am, even with my status.

Mxolisi: Ndiyayazi ukuthi labantwana laba mabe thandana nani kuthiwa ningo sugar daddy bafuna imali yena akunike into. So uyamnika imali or umthengela imphahla, umenzelani ukum keeper ukuba abe kule ndaba yenu? [IsiZulu] With these youngsters, when they are in a relationship with a "sugar daddy", they want money for something in return. Do you give her money or buy her clothes? What are you doing to keep her in the relationship ?

Man: Yena asimuntu odomanda kakhulu when it comes kwi mali yabona atleast maka needer something endinga afforder ukumenzela yona ndiyamenzela. [IsiZulu] She's not the very demanding when it comes to money, but when she needs something, I do that for her.

Mxolisi: So uyamnikeza imali? [IsiZulu] So you do give her money?

Man: Ngiyamnikeza imali makeyidinga for into e-important yabo. [IsiZulu] Yes, when it's for something important.

Mxolisi: Njena ujola nalomntwana uproud na? [IsiZulu] Are you proud that you are involved with a youngster?

Man: Ja uyazi ukuthini I feel like a man uyandivisisa because undi phethe right and mina uyandi respector yinto e-important leyo [IsiZulu] Yes, you know that. Eish, I feel like a real man because she treats me right and respects me, that's important.

Shalom: Ingabe abesilisa noma amadoda asemadala kuyadingeka ukuthi athandane namathombazana asemancane, ukuze aziswe engamadoda aphelele na nigcabanga ini ngalokhu. [IsiZulu] Do older man have to have young girls to make themselves feel more manly, what do you think guys?

Luckyboy: Ubhuthi lo u-open nge si status sakhe and uyayinika intombazana iption they have to use ama condoms. But I disadvantage yakhona hukuthi like he has mmore power over her. If njeba ubonile ukuba angatsho yena ukuthi bangasebenzisi ama condoms angekhe bawasebenzise. Kodwa into engingayitsho mina to all the young people aba in relationships nabantu abadala kubo ukuthi fanele usticker kumuntu ozovuma ukuthi nisebenzise ama condoms because at the end of the day impilo yeyakho kufanele ukuthi ube responsible nawe nge mpilo wakho. Never mind ukuthi ukule relationship ngoba uthola okuncane ukuthi mhlawumbe usupporter ekhaya o ungene kwi relationship because of ukuthi kukhona izinto ozitholayo wena yourself. [IsiZulu] That guy is open about his status and he gives his girl the option to use condoms. But the disadvantage I see is that he has more power over her. If he refused to use a condom, they wouldn't use condom. To all the young people that are in relationships with older partners, you have to stick to the partner that is for condom use because this is your life and you have to take responsibility for it. Never mind that you're doing this to support your family or maybe you just want a few gifts for yourself.

Busi: Kukho into ethi nizakuvumelana nam kulonto leyo xa uthandana nomntu otshatileyo ukhuselekile because uyamazi u stable relationship. I don't know what that means. Okokuqala kutheni ungayichingi into yokuba kutheni eshita nawe unomfazi lomntu kodwa uya shita. But abantu bana la mentality yokuba hayi kungcono ukuthandana nomntu otshatileyo ngoba uyazazi into youkuba nguwe wedwa kuloo mntu besides umfazi wakhe. And then kengoku ibankhona nala nqondo yokuba okay kuba ndina loo mntu lona ndikhuselekile atleast ngumntu o matured omdala andinakufumana ngculaza kuye forgeting the point into bana kulanto ubukhe wayi mentiona nokubonga yokuba lomntu kudala ehamba. Now uyabuya ubuyela apha kuwe uza apha kuwe ungumntwana akasebenzisi zi condoms, ngenxa yezi zizathu sesi zibekile into youkuba why bengazu sebenzisa icondom ukunikeza HIV. [IsiXhosa] You will all agree, people say that if you're with a married person, you're safe because they're in a stable relationship. They're only sleeping with one person. Why don't you think about why he's cheating on his wife you? People just have this mentality that it's better to be with a married man because you think you're the only one besides his wife. And maybe you also think he's older, he's mature and he won't give you HIV, forgetting that Nokubonga said, this man has been around a lot. Now he's coming back to this young girl and he doesn't want to use a condom and passes HIV on to the young girl.

Nokubonga: And nalanto yena sisi Busi thina singamantombazana singabona baqala kuqala ukuthandana kuna bantu abango bhuti ngoba singabona bakawulezi sayo ukukhula. Then uye uthi apha ekuthandaneni uqonde ukuba no man ndimdala umzekelo ubhuti ongeko luki uthi hayi hayi owuyontanga yam ngoku ndifuna ubhuti wakho okanye utata wakho. Una 14,15,16 ufuna ukuthandana nabantu abadala. Usuke pha ku 35 years uyehla uyotso ku 20 years ufike usulele abo basaqalayo ukuthandana ke ngoku uyayi bona. [IsiXhosa] And girls tend to start dating much earlier than boys because we mature faster than boys. You date a couple of boys and you think you're old, you say you want their big brother and older men. You're about 14, 15,16 and you want a 35 year old man.From there you go back to a 20 year old man therefore infecting the younger generation.

Luckyboy: Anginguye umuntu wesifazane but ke ngikhe nga involve no someone who was older than me ebendala kimi. The think eyandeza ngi sticker kuloo relationship kwakukuthi I get something kuloo mntu lona. Its all about ukuthi uyayazi siyi youth umasikhula you want to fit in, ube ne jean ethize ilabel ethize ibe ne tekkie ethize. Kungatsho ukuthi ekhaya engekhe ba affoder ukundithengela lezo zinto lezo. But ngoba mina I wanted to have more I found myself being in that relationship. [IsiZulu] I'm not a woman but I was once involved with someone older than me. What made me stick to the relationship was that I got something from him. You know when you're young it's all about fitting in with nice jeans and fancy shoes, not that my parents couldn't afford to buy me those things, but because I want more, I found myself in that relationship.

Shalom: Bekhukhona nje ukuthi umcele ukuthi nisebenzise ama-condoms whenever you had sex. [IsiZulu] Could you ask him to use a condom whenever you had sex?

Luckyboy: Azange sakhe sakhe sayisebenzisa icondom ngoba bendikule relationship for two years icondom asizange siysebenzise kuyo yonke itwo years. [IsiZulu] We never used condoms. I was in the relationship for two years and we used condoms, not once.

Shalom: As a result you consider it as a long term relationship? [IsiZulu] So you considered it a long term relationship?

Luckyboy: It was a long term relationship ngi faithful kuye we never used condoms because I never thought HIV is going to happen to me. Bengazi ukuthi iHIV ikhona but the way ebendicabanga ngakhona ukuthi iHIV yeyabantu abahamba belala abanama partners amaningi. So mina bene partner eyi-one so iHIV was something that cuold never happen to me. [IsiZulu] It was a long term relationship and I was faithful to him, we just never used condoms because I never thought HIV would happen to me. I knew about the existence of HIV, but I thought it only affects those who sleep around with many sexual partners. I only had one partner so HIV was something that would never happen to me.

Shalom: If you had to look back at what happened to you and based on that, what advice would you give kwi youth ephila ngaphandle abasenza lezi zinto lezi ezokuthi bathandane nabantu abadala ngendaba zokuthi bafuna imali, bafuna imali yokuthenga ama brands, bakwazi ukuba fashionable and staff, what would you say to them. [IsiZulu] If you had to look back at what happened to you and based on that, what advice would you give to any young person that is involved with an older person for money to buy fancy clothing brands, to look fashionable and staff? What would you say to them?

Luckyboy: Mangibheka emuva nginganikwa ichance yokubuyela umuva bengingekhe ndivume ukuthi yenzakale lonto leyo ngiyithole ngikuloo relationship. Oh if kuyenzakala ngikuyo loo relationship because of ngithanda izinto bengizokwazi ukuthi ngi khulume izinto sokuthi sisebenzise icondom. Ngoba ukuze abonise ukuthi uyandithanda kuvanele andifikele ngoba uyazi yena umore experienced he's been through izinto eziningi that I haven't been through. And uthando aluboniswa ukuthi umuntu kufanele akunikeze imali [IsiZulu] If I had a chance to go back, I would never be involved in such a relationship. If I were to get in one just because I'm naughty, I would certainly insist on using condoms. He has to show his love by protecting me because he is more experienced, he's been through a lot of staff that I haven't gone through. And you don't show your love for a person by giving them money.

Shalom: Sisathatha ikhefu masinyane, siyabuya manje. [IsiZulu] We're taking a quick break, stay where you are.

Shalom: Siyakwamkela futhi. Sigxoxa ngamantombazana aya ogcantsini nabe silisa abadala kunawo ngoba efuna imali nezifumbathiso. Akhe sihlole ukuthi lokhu kunobungozi obungakanani. [IsiZulu] Welcome back. We are talking about young women who have sex with older guys for money and material gifts. Let's check out the risks of such behavior.

Tumi: Emphakathini sonke siyazi ukuthi kunabantu abakuma relationship nabantu abadala kunabo. Namhlanje sizokhuluma nosisi ozakusichazela kuze kanjani ukuze angene kule relationship [IsiZulu] We all know that in the community there are people involved with people older than them. Today, we speak to a lady who will tell us how she got involved is such a relationship.

Tumi: So uhlangene njani nalo bhuti? [IsiZulu] So how did you meet this man?

Woman: Ngangifuna ukuya ekhaya. So kune bhasi emile ndifuna ukubuza ukuthi ibhasi iyakuphi . So ngahamba ngaya kwbabhuti ngabusa ukuthi ibhasi le iyakuphi ihamba nini ngabani isikhathi.So wabe senditsela ukuthi nginike ana number wakho ngoba manje ibhasi igcwele then mna I call you ngikutsele ukuthi izoba ne space nini ukuze ukhone ukuhamba. Wangifowunela wednesday night wandibuza ukuthi ngingubani, ngihlala kuphi, why ngihlala la ePretoria ngifuna ukuyothini ekhaya. So wathi ngingabina problem ukuthi ngogibela ngamalini. Mangi buya wandi dropper ePretoria wandinika iR200. I was happy for that because I like imali. So wanditsela ukuthi next time makaphinda eza ucela ukuza la eroomini yam. Zange ndibone problem ngoba ngihambe free ngihle free and I get R200 above so I was very happy. [IsiZulu] I wanted to go home. I saw a parked bus and wanted to know where it was going. I went to these men and asked where the bus was going and what time. He said the bus was full, but give me your number then I'll call you when there is space. He called me the Wednesday night, and asked me who I am and where I live, why I'm in Pretoria and why I wanted to go home. He told me not to worry about the bus fare. Then when I came back, he dropped me in Pretoria and gave me R200. I was happy for that because I like money. So he said the next time he comes, he wants to come to my room. I didn't have a problem with that because I traveled for free, ate free and got R200 on top of that so I was happy.

Tumi: So uyazi nge status sakho? [IsiZulu] Does he know about your status?

Woman: Zange siyikhulume, I didn't tell him ukuthi I am HIV positive. [IsiZulu] We never spoke about it. I didn't tell him that I was HIV positive.

Tumi: Niyawasebenzisa ama condom? [IsiZulu] Do you use condoms?

Woman: But because bendifuna sisebenzise amacondoms because am using icondom everytime am having sex but wayala then ke nge saba mina ukumtsela ukuthi uyi yalile icondom, ukuthi mkhulu undipha imali undenzela evertthing. Ndacabanga ukuthi iyo mangandimtsela ukuthi am HIV positive uzo runner out yabona. [IsiZulu] I wanted to use condom because I use a condom every time I have sex, but he refused to use a condom and I was scared to tell him because he is old, he gives me money and does everything for me. I was scared if I told him I'm HIV positive, he would leave me.

Tumi: Unomfazi, unabantwana une fameli? [IsiZulu] Does he have a wife, kids. Does he have a family?

Woman: Unomfazi nabantwana the way atsho ngakhona [IsiZulu] Yes, he has a wife and children. That's what he says.

Tumi: Uyazi umfazi wakhe ngawe noma ? [IsiZulu] Does the wife know about you?

Woman: No akazi lutho. Akazi nokuthi unomuntu athandana naye the way anditsela ngakhona. [IsiZulu] No, she knows nothing. She doesn't even know he's having an affair.

Tumi: So ezizinto akwenzela zona ukupha imali ukwenzelani? [IsiZulu] So what does he give you? Gives you money and what else?

Woman: Everything engiyifunayo like kuye am always ndifuna imali. Mangithi ndifuna malini undinika lomali ndiyifunayo. Yiyo lonto ebendiyithanda kuye but manje I'm trying ukuthiun ngimyeke because I'm afraid of I'm HIV positive and asisebenzisi condom. And now I'm getting i-relationship eserious so I don't want him andi distaber. [IsiZulu] Everything I need, I always need money. If I say how much I need, he gives it to me. That's what I liked about him, but now I want us to end it because I'm HIV positive and afraid of having unprotected sex. And now I'm in a serious relationship with someone else so I don't want him to interfere with that.

Tumi: Le realationship ongena kuyo lomuntu wakhona u how old? [IsiZulu] How old is this person you're in a relationship with?

Woman: Lomuntu longithandana naye manje ngoka 1973 (35yrs) [IsiZulu] Then one I am involved with now was born in 1973 (35yrs).

Tumi: Uyasazi istatus sakho. [IsiZulu] Does he know about your status?

Woman: Uyasazi istatus sam ngimtselile akana problem nge status sam but yena uthi azange atester but we are using amacondoms mina naye. [IsiZulu] Yes he knows about my status.

Shalom: Laa sithola ukuthi usisi Noluvuyo iexperience yakhe ungumuntu ongena mali althogether and lobhuti ahlanganaye ungumuntu ozakufike a filler in la gap anayo bese aphe imali apha yonke into ayifunayo. Like umuzwe ngoku akhulumayo no abe ngipha imali lento yenza impilo yam ibe lula. I couldn't say no because yinto ebendiyidinga. So leyo nto leyo kimi it bring about ipoint indaba yokuhlubeka kwabantu yiyo e pusher i-prevalence kakhulu ye HIV. [IsiZulu] I think that Noluvuyo is someone who doesn't have money altogether and she sees this guy as someone who's going to fill that gap by buying her money and everything she needs. He would give her money and she couldn't say no because that's what she needed. That to me means that survival and the need for money is yet another contributing factor to the high prevalence of HIV.

Busi: Asina kugweba abantu sithi mabangazenzi ezizinto ezo ngoba zimeko abaphila kuzo. Jonga umzekelo uNoluvuyo akanamsebenzi masithi unomntwana ekufuneka mhlawumbi emnakekele akhukho mali ingenayo mhlawumbi akafumani nezo granti sikarhulumente. So xa kukho imali elula ngoluhlobo ngubani onothi hayi. Asifuni uku judge because abantu bazenza izinto ngenxa yezizathu imeko ngemeko zabantu zohluka hlukile. There is nothing we can do about that sizivile imeko zabo bobathathu ababantu abaya ukuyotso kusisi Noluvuyo but then the key word here is suppose ibe kukusetyenziswa kwe condom. Ndizikhusele ndikhusele nawe okanye ndizikhusele ndikhusele nomnye umntu. [IsiXhosa] We can't really dictated to people and say no don't do this because sometimes it's the circumstance they live under. Take Noluvuyo for example, maybe she doesn't have a job. Maybe she has a child to take care of and there's no source of income, even in the form of government grants. So who can really say no when money can be made easily this way? We're trying to judge anybody here, people do things for different reasons. There's nothing we can do about that, we all heard three different stories today, but then the key message here is suppose to be the use of condoms to protect myself and to protect the next person!

Nokubonga: Endingayikhuthaza mna umntu makawqale azithande yena phambi koba athande lomntu umthandayo. Ngobana sesinde singazi sebenzisi icondoms uyamthanda lomntu umdala uthandana naye but phambi koba umthande, umthandele ude ungasebenzisi icondom naye qala uzithande wena, uzazi yintoni oyifunayo ebomini and uyaphi wena because awuphelelanga nje apha, awuphelelanga kulama bitsho uyafunayo. Usenendlela oseza kuyihamba apha ebomini so ukuzithanda kuqala. [IsiXhosa] Young women should love themselves before they love anyone else. We end up not using condoms because we love these old guys, but before you love him so much so much that you don't care about using condoms, first love yourself and know what you want in life. And have some directions in life because there's more to life than brands. You have your life ahead of you so please love yourself.

Shalom: Abesifazane abancane kufanele baxhile esikolweni bathole imfundo basiqalele amabhizinisi noma bazitholele umsebenzi. Yizinto ekufanele bazisebenzele. Ukuthola okufunayo manje sekukuthatha indlela enqamlelayo kepha enentengo enkulu. Ungafinyelela lapho lula ngaphandle kokuba nengculaza yizwa ngami. Nomayini oyenzayo kumbula ukuhlolwa. Sebenzisa ityazi lo mkwenyana ngaso sonke isikathi. Zivikele uvikele nabanye. Imibuzo nokuphawula kwenu kumqokwa kithi. Xhumana nathi kuleminini ngwana evele kumabona kude manje. Xhumana nathi kwi website wethu lapho ungaphinda ubone uhlelo lwethu lanamhlanje. Kude kube ngokuzayo Zivikele, uvikele nabanye nisale kahle. [IsiZulu] Young woman should stay at school and get a proper education, look at starting their own business or getting a job. These are the things they should work for. Getting what you want now is a short cut with a big price. You can get there better without HIV, takes it from. Whatever you are doing, remember, get tested and always use a condom. Protect yourself and protect others! Your questions and comments are really important to us. Contact us at the details on screen now. Check out our web site where you can view today's show again. Until next week protect yourself, protect others! Bye Bye