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Siyayinqoba Beat It! 2004 Episode 4 – Learners beat HIV

In this week’s episode of Siyayinqoba Beat It! we heard how teenagers dealt with discrimination when disclosing to their families and peers. Nwabisa Njaba, a HIV positive learner joined the Siyayinqoba Beat It! Support Group in studio to share her experiences on when and how she disclosed her status and what challenges she had to face at school.

Jason Wessenaar: Hi, welcome to Siyayinqoba Beat It! Support Group. My name is Jason and I’m living with HIV. Each week I get together with other people living with HIV to talk about issues that affect us, our partners, our family members and friends. So if you’re living with HIV or know someone who’s living with HIV, Siyayinqoba is for you. Today we visit an awesome group of learners who are living openly with HIV. Joining us is a beautiful young woman, Nwabisa Njaba who is here to talk to us about the challenges of being HIV positive at school. Let’s hear what some very brave and outspoken young people living with HIV have to say.

Learners beat HIV at school

Khayelitsha, Cape Town

Lerato Matasane (Learner living with HIV): I just want to ask Babalwa something; I want to know about your life. How do you cope? Let me say for example you are walking there and someone says: “Woo just look at her she is HIV positive”, and how do you feel about that?

Babalwa Tembani (Learner living with HIV): Nda-decide mna uba mandbonise abantu abatsha, nda-disclose i-status sam, ndibonise uba i-HIV ikhona especially kuthi bantu batsha because every Saturday ubunoya eKhayelitsha, uzobona kungwatywa umnt’omtsha. Uba u-HIV eswelekile. So ndazidecidela mna ok mandi-disclose, zange kubekho mntu undifostayo, ndazenzela. {IsiXhosa} [I decided to disclose my status and show that HIV is here, especially for us youth. Because every Saturday in Khayelitsha you see us bury the youth who’ve died of AIDS. So no-one forced me to disclose. I did it on my own.]

Nwabisa Njaba: Nam u-disclosa kwam esikolweni, ndaqala eklasini yam then nda-disclozela isikolo sonke. Emveni koko yangulowo nalowo oza kum ezobuza ba kengoku ma’am Salakhi xa kuthe kwathi, kwenziwa njani. Then esikolweni sabe si-formisha i-group, i-AIDS Task Team. {IsiXhosa} [First I disclosed to my class and then to the whole school. After that, students came to me with their problems. Then we formed the AIDS Task Team in my school.]

Linda Pindani (Learner living with HIV): I-problem yam apho ikhoyo. Uyi-female une-information and une-education. Maybe i-boyfriend yakho ine-lack of information, ine-lack of education kwi HIV and AIDS. Nakwi-condom ine lack and then kengoku ifuna ukulala nawe, you know i-status sakho uba you are HIV positive. So ndichazele ke, uzolala nayo okanye awuzulala nayo sisi? {IsiXhosa} [My problem here. You’re a woman with the information and the education. Maybe your boyfriend lacks the information and education on HIV and AIDS. Even on condoms he lacks information. And then he wants to sleep with you and you know that you are HIV positive. So tell me, will you sleep with him or not?]

Nwabisa Njaba: Ungazixeleli uba yi-O yakho kudala nathandana. Nalanto yoba uzixelele into yoba u-HIV positive nam ndi-HIV positive, so yintoni i-need yoba sisebenzise i-condom? Sisa-prevent ntoni, si-HIV positive sobabini mos. So yintoni ebangela ba masisebenzise i-condom? Sana, ayithethi lonto leyo. Sebenzisani i-condom nobabini even if ndi-HIV positive naye u-HIV positive. Sebenzisani i-condom nobabini. Just because awuzazi i-opportunistic infections anazo, naye akazazi endinazo mna. Sizonikezelana kaloku sana, uzondinek’ezakhe nam ndimnike ezam kuphele kubekho ogula msinyane. So guys i-condom bethunana mayisetyenziswe. {IsiXhosa} Don’t tell yourself you’ve been involved with your boyfriend for long. Even if you tell yourself that he’s HIV positive and you are also HIV positive; don’t say there’s no need for both of you to use a condom, what are we preventing, since we’re both positive, we don’t have to use a condom, It doesn’t make sense. Use a condom even if both of you are HIV positive. Use a condom since you don’t know about his opportunistic infections and he doesn’t know about mine. He’ll get my infection and someone is going to be sick. So guys, I prefer that we must use condoms.

Nolubabalo Mkona, (Learner living with HIV): I Mna andibeki blame echerini, mhlawumbi icheri xa i-positive okanye i-O ipositive, andibeki blame ye-partner kwenye i-partner. Every partner iyayazi into yoba I must use i-condom ngoku xa ndizokwenza i-sex. And i-most yabantu bayayazi uba ikhona i-HIV and inintsi. Xa uzawu-riska ke wena uthi inyam’enyameni uyaze into yobana HIV is here. {IsiXhosa} [Don’t blame the girl if she’s positive or the guy if he’s positive. I don’t put blame on one partner. Every partner must know that they must use a condom if they want sex. Most people know that HIV and AIDS exist and it’s everywhere. If you want to risk flesh-to-flesh, you must know HIV is here.]

Support Group

Jason Wessenaar: Nwabisa, please share with us your experiences of living positively with HIV.

Nwabisa Njaba: U-testa kwam, ndayo-testa ndifunda eZola High School then after that nda-disclosa eskolweni sam. Firstly nda-disclozela i-class yam. Zange bandi-believe into yoba ndi-HIV positive just because bazi umnt’one-AIDS e-thin. Then sa-educate kengoku class to class esikolweni. Then ndaba-explainela kengoku about HIV/AIDS, kwabakho utishala ozama und-discriminate but naleyo into ndayi-report then kengoku ya-sortwa out. Wabe e-apologise endixelela uba ebengayazi uba ndi-HIV positiven then zange ndi-face discrimination esikolweni.{Isxhosa} [My first HIV test I did was in Zola High School. Then after that I disclosed at my school. First I disclosed in my class. They did not believe that I was HIV positive because they thought a person with AIDS is suppose to look thin. Then we started explaining class by class at school. Then I started explaining to them about HIV, although there was a teacher who discriminated against me but then I reported the matter and the teacher later apologised. That teacher told me that he was not aware that I’m HIV positive. Since then I did not experience further discrimination at school.]

Prudence Mabele: Today, even with the disclosure, you still hear people calling us amagama amathathu [three names.] When I was thin last year I was being told: “Ooh, she looks like an AIDS case now”, you know all of those things. But where do you get your courage? You know, besides the support at the school?

Nwabisa Njaba: When I tested HIV positive I joined TAC, Treatment Action Campaign, that’s where also I got a lot of support, and also I joined a support group in Site C clinic, Nolungile Clinic, and that’s where I got a support.

Busisiwe Maqungo: After I tested, I’m fine, ja, I’m fine, I don’t have a problem, ja, I get the support from my family, from the community, but we forget to mention Okokuqala before we get this strength soba sibanje, siyalibala ukubaxelela abantu uba… [firstly, before we got this strength to be as strong as we are, we tend to forget to share how we felt before,] when we found out we were HIV positive, this is what I thought, this is what came in Enqondweni yam … [my mind] I was worried about what people will say. Uyabona zonke ezozinto ezo…[You see, all of those things.] Can you take us… Ja, and Uba kwenzeka ntoni especially xa ungumfundi, [especially as a learner, it must be difficult for you as a student.] {IsiXhosa}

Nwabisa Njaba: Ndine-HIV andina-AIDS and eskolweni abafani abantwana, bayaziwa ngokugeza. Vele yayibakhona lento yoba yhoo soze bangabikho abo bazothetha izinto ezibheke ecaleni, babe bethetha uba unamagama amathathu. Bebekhona vele abantu but bebengathethi kum directly abanye. But umntu athethe izofikelela kum into yokubana kuthethwa kanje nakanje ngawe. But nakum noko yayikhe indi-hurtishe ke lento just because akumnandanga xa kuthethwa ngawe kusithiwa une-AIDS. Ayikho mnandi lonto leyo. {IsiXhosa} [I have HIV, not AIDS. And you find that at school the learners can be very silly. I knew that there will be those who will be silly. Those who will say things like the three names. There were those who said it but not directly to me, although somehow I would know about it. At times it would hurt me because it’s not nice when people say that you have AIDS.]

Nomandla Yako: I agree with Nwabisa because I remember when I was 19, 20 years old I was doing matric at school, I had this rash in my face and my neck and the students were talking about me, saying that I have HIV, but I was not tested by that time. But, when my son was born and he was sick, I had to do HIV test and lomthwalo onzima for mna … [there was this very big load,] I was planning of killing myself, and I didn’t want people to pester me about having HIV. Ja, so I was planning those things, so things have really changed, we don’t suffer like we used to, because Izinto azisafani nak’qala… Ndikulendawo ndikuyo ngoku ndiyaqhubekeka ngobomi… [things have changed. I’m here today still carrying on with my future,] I have my child, although I don’t know about the boyfriend story, because it’s not going too well. {IsiXhosa}

: Kuba-difficult wethu just because if u-HIV positive, just because awubhalwanga mos aph’ebusweni uba u-HIV positive. I-guy izokuza kum izondi-proposa and then like at first kwakungekho easy uba ndimxelele uba ndi-HIV positive just because ii-guys ziyageza and umntu uzohambe’hlekisa ngawe into yokubana yhuu lanmntana une-AIDS, iinto ezinjalo. But at that time ndaniyokwenza i-HIV test ja ndandinayo i-boyfriend and naye waye HIV positive…, but after ndiyixelele uba ndi-HIV positive yavele yaba-funny, yatshintsha but yaphela kelo-relationship iphela. {isiXhosa} [It’s difficult because, when you are HIV positive, because it’s not like it’s written on your face, that you are HIV positive. And a guy would come to me and propose. At first it was not easy to tell them I’m HIV positive. Guys are also silly and can go around making you a laughing stock. Saying that, that girl has AIDS, things like that. At the time I went for my HIV test I did have a boyfriend who was also HIV positive. After telling him I’m HIV positive he changed and starting acting funny. The relationship ended, completely.]

Busisiwe Maqungo: For men, it’s very easy. They disclose to people they want, their new partners, and they don’t encounter any problems. Now it makes us think, must I disclose, or shall I just leave it like that and insist that we use a condom? Because if I do disclose to this person he is going to run as fast as they can, so, ja, they do that, you disclose to them; you’re chasing them away.

Jason Wessenaar: The first three years after my diagnosis, nobody really wanted to have anything to do with me. So it’s not only women who face that, I think men in general finds that. Uh, and also the view that people have about men, that men are perpetrators of rape and abuse and stuff like that, it’s in a sense, I would like to see a situation where men are looked as role models, as people who are bringing a positive light and saying that: “You know what, before we go out, before we get into sexual activities, here is my status, this is what you need to know”, just to go away from the whole thing of blaming men for everything that happens bad to women. But I think the same thing happens to men. We get rejected as much as women do. And sometimes you never really know when is the right time to disclose your status, whether at the beginning, or after a few months, or after you’ve been sexually involved with this person, so we sort of really face more or less the same thing.

Anthony Fernandes: If young people start saying, we’re HIV positive, it just becomes so much more normal. And rightfully so, because this is something that’s gonna be around for a while, I’m not gonna make it something special, put it on the shelf and say: “Oh wow, look at me, I’ve got HIV, I’m HIV positive.” That’s it, get over it. The rest of my life is normal. I can work, I can have fun, I can go on holidays, just like everybody else.

Jason Wessenaar: We are going to a break. Stay tuned.

Jason Wessenaar: Re boetse re a le amohela mona mo Siyaqoba Support Group. {SeSotho} [Welcome back to Siyayinqoba Support Group.] Nwabisa and her friends are all actively involved in HIV/AIDS work at their school. The Siyayinqoba Team went to Esangweni High, to see how they were tackling HIV/AIDS in the school.

Learners beat HIV

Khayelitsha, Cape Town

Nodumo Speelman: Igama lam ndinguNodumo, ifani ndingowaSpeelman. Ndiphuma kwi-Task Team yalapha eskolweni. Silulutsha olulwa nentsholongwane kagawulayo. Kwizikolo zonke zikhona i-Task Teams but zikhona ezinye izikolo ezingenayo i-Task Team. Thina silutsha lalapha eskolweni kulevekim yiveki ye-awareness. Sifuna ukuxelela abafundi about HIV and AIDS because i-affecta thina bafundi. {IsiXhosa} [My name is Nodumo Speelman. I’m part of the task team of the school. We are fighting this HIV and AIDS. Some schools have a task team but some schools don’t have them. This week is a week of awareness for the youth here at school. We want to teach the learners about HIV and AIDS, yebo, because it affects us as learners.]

Young man: Uba aawukazi-testi hamba uyozi-testa, uzawubona ba uphi na. {ISiXhosa} [If you haven’t been tested, go and test so you know where you stand.]

Young woman: Silwela anachiza e-AIDS. {IsiXhosa} [We are fighting for the medicines for AIDS.]

Young man: HIV, it’s the Human Immuno Deficiency Virus.

Young woman: Xa usebenzisa i-condom akho infection iyenzayo yona i-condom kuba iyi-plastic ngoba ingena enyameni yomntu. {IsiXhosa} [If you use a condom, can you get an infection, because it’s plastic touching the flesh of a person?]

Young man: Xa usebenzisa i-condom, uya-preventa i-HIV and AIDS. {IsiXhosa} [If you use a condom, you’re preventing HIV and AIDS.]

Nwabisa Njaba: Mna ke guys ndi-HIV positive, so ndaziva ngo-2001. But andiqondi ukhona umntu ondibonayo uba ndi-HIV, niyanadibona? Ndayamkela, ekhaya ndaziwa nangumntwana omngaka, ndaziwa naye-boyfriend yam akhomntu ungandaziyo. {IsiXhosa} [Guys, like, I’m HIV positive. I’ve known since 2001. But I don’t think there’s anyone who can see that I’m HIV positive. I’ve accepted it. At home, even the little ones know. My boyfriend knows; there isn’t anyone who doesn’t know.]

Onscreen text states: Learners teaching teachers.

Young man: Eyonanto endizothetha ngayo mna zi-STDs nento ekuthiwa yi-herpes. Mhlawumbi ubenezilonda apha kwi-vagina le yomntu ongumama kwi-lips ezi zayo okanye kubekho amadyungudyunguza akhoyo. Okanye kubekho izitretshanyana ezikhoyo. Nalapha kumntu ongubhuti zibakhona, ufumaniseke apha kubhuti lo wakhe zikhona izilond’ezikhoyo. Ikhona ke i-treatment yayo, Acyclovir. {IsiXhosa} [I’m going to talk about STDs. We get things like herpes. Perhaps you get sores on the woman’s vagina. You know, on the lips of the vagina, there will be sores or blisters or minor scratches. In men, the same thing happens. There are sores on their penises, there are blisters. The treatment for this is Acyclovir.]

Onscreen text: Learners have an AIDS bash.

TAC banner is shown pinned up, it states:

1976 Youth against apartheid

2002: Youth against HIV/AIDS
HIV does not DISCRIMINATE, WHY DO WE?

Tobi: Thank you so much for inviting us, it’s a pleasure ukuthi sila nani … [that we are here with you,] and ja, I hope you enjoy the day.{IsiXhosa}

Young man: Silapha eKahyelitsha, izikolo eziyi-15 bezi-participate apha. {IsiXhosa} [There are 15 schools participating here in Khayelitsha.]

Young woman: I want to fight with this thing, HIV, I want to fight with AIDS, I want to support those people who are HIV positive.

Young women: You understand that, ja, there is HIV and there is AIDS, so there is something that we are doing about it.

Young women: We firstly established a support group about AIDS, STDs and STIs and teenage pregnancy. We organised school awareness week, and we had different programmes during the week.

Young man: We are educating, but in an entertaining way. We are doing what is called ‘edutainment’.

Support group

Jason Wessenaar: The AIDS Action Committees are showing us that young people want to be involved, and that it’s not just about sex and condoms.

Vuyani Jacobs: You take those kids, they’re not only in schools, they’re going back to their communities, they’re going back and to the hokkie to smoke, like the rest of us, they’re all part of the overall society. Now they go back to those streets with a clear empowering, within the mind, within the face.

John Vollenhoven: Since you came out, what is the vibe amongst other people to see if they have a future now? Can they really say they have a future or are they negative or is it positive?

Nwabisa Njaba: After I’ve disclosed to the learners at my school their attitude has changed because they have seen this learner who says she is HIV positive but she still looks beautiful as you can see, for yourself. She has tested HIV positive which means that even if we have tested HIV positive, we are still going to look good and we are still going to have the same dreams and hopes, and live a happy, normal, healthy life, stop drinking and smoking, ja.

Anthony Fernandes: Do you think the boys at school has definitely changed their attitude in the sense of taking responsibility. It’s not their attitude to say, for example: “Oh, we can do whatever we want because the girls are informed, they should have the condoms, and if we do get HIV there’s still a whole future.” Is there a negative side to this? Are you hearing things that you don’t want to hear? I mean, obviously the message is that you don’t want anyone who is negative to become positive.

Nwabisa Njaba: Some of them, they do test positive, but they are still in denial. They just tell themselves: “Okay now, I’m not HIV positive, and if I’m HIV positive I’m not going to die alone.” Especially boys, they do that. And they also think it’s the responsibility of the girls to use condoms.

Prudence Mabele: Kule age esikuyo umuntu angahlala and abe-responsible… So ihamba kanjani i-message ye-abstinence? {IsiXhosa} [At the age we are now, a person can stay, be responsible and not have sex. So how is the message of abstaining going?]

Nwabisa Njaba: Noba siyabaxelela uba ok guys abstanani but also sibaxelele nangento ye-condom… when we are telling them to use a condom, it’s not like siyabathuma uba mabaheve i-sex. Vele abantwana nbesikolo nge-sex ke kunzima ubaxelela ngoba bazokuxelela uba yhu uthi mandi-abstain, nam ndifun’uva lento iviwa ngabanye. That is why kufuneka ubaxelele nge-condom kwenzele lo usenala-attitude yoba naye ufuna uyiheva i-sex just because abanye abantu bayaheva akwazi into bana asebenzise i-condom. {IsiXhosa} [Even though we tell them to abstain, but also telling them about using condoms. When we are telling them to use a condom it’s not like we are sending them to go and have sex. We know how school kids are when it comes to sex. It’s difficult because they will say: “Why must we abstain? We also want to feel what other people are feeling.” Things like that. So, for those who are having sex, because other people are doing it, they should use condoms.]

Onscreen text: Should condoms be more accessible in our schools?

Vuyani Jacobs: There should be condoms in schools. They should not be only in the classroom, in the teacher’s room or the teacher’s office. They must be where the students are, in the toilets, in every class there should be condoms, I’m sure. Let’s actually do that.

Lihle Dlamini: There’s a lot of you out here who are in a stage of experimenting things in love. Some find out they are HIV positive, and do hang themselves. In Mina kulelokishi endihlala kulona awupheli unyaka ungenama-teenagers awu-2 or awu-3 ayilingisile…[my location, the year will not end without two or three teenagers committing] suicide just because they found out they’re HIV positive. and abakwazi ufey’sa ama-parents wabo, banaleyo-fear ukuthi … Lento niyenzayo esikolweni sakho… [They don’t know how to face their parents.] They ask themselves: “How will I face my parents? How will I face my friends? How will life go on?” And I think [what you are doing at your school] is very important. Each and every school must have HIV and AIDS committees, Ukuze abantu aba-HIV positive abancane babenama-support groups abo, babene-age group efanayo because abanye bayesaba ukuya kwabantu abadala because abantu abadala bathe wazini nge-HIV and AIDS, wazini nge-sex. [so that young people with HIV can have support groups] who are in their own age group. Most of them are afraid to approach older people, because they will ask: “What do you know about HIV and AIDS and sex?] You are so young and you are getting into sex?” Abanye abantwana uthola ukuthi umzali… [With some children you find that the parents] are ashamed of her child’s HIV status that the parents actually chases the child away from the house. {IsiZulu}

Jason Wessenaar: Stay with us because after the break we are joined by Thembeka Plenis, a guidance teacher from Esangweni School.

Jason Wessenaar: Welcome back to Siyayinqoba Support Group and welcome to Thembeka Plenis, a guidance teacher at Esangweni High. Thembeka, what should educators be doing to integrate HIV/AIDS programmes in school?

Teachers beat HIV

Esangweni High School

Thembeka Plenis (Esangweni High School Guidance Counsellor): When I started my HIV awareness programmes in class as a life-skills educator, I had a problem whereby I see this reluctancy in the side of the learners that they see HIV as something that is not existing and all such things. And that was something that was bothering me a lot. I want the learners to go for testing, to know their status. I organised an HIV awareness week. I called Nwabisa, and she was so young then she was doing grade eleven. And she opened up in classes, she disclosed in classes about her status. After disclosure, learners got interested. And the testing grew.

John Vollenhoven: You just said now that 14 and 15 year olds are having sex, don’t you think it’s a good idea, seeing that HIV is increasing amongst the youth, to have condoms in schools?

Thembeka Plenis: Having condoms at school is a very much good idea. We have introduced that one in my school. We have got condoms and we also run awarenesses because we believe that having condoms without them knowing how they are used, how to use them because we can’t just give them condoms, they need to be educated on how to use them.

Jason Wessenaar: I heard you speaking about the fact that you are promoting abstinence. And obviously at the age of twelve, eleven, thirteen, people are starting to discover themselves. They are growing a beard and all that, they want to experiment, and that’s where most of us started actually having out first sexual experiences. But how are people, you know, receiving the messages of abstinence?

Thembeka Plenis: My purpose is for me to win them, because I’m a mother, I’m a parent too. I’m thinking of a situation whereby my kid would be sexually active at that age. What is going to happen? Because I feel that even if one is much more equipped about the prevention and what not, somewhere, somehow, a mistake is going to happen. People get used to each other, and they say: “Hayi suka, we’ve been together for quite a long time, why are we still using this? And you’ve been faithful to me for quite a long time.” And really, if we look at things, one gets careless on the way.

Nomandla Yako: I remember it was 2002 I went to the other school and I disclosed, and the other teacher said to me: “If my child can be HIV positive I will chase the child away. I can’t stay with an HIV positive people.” So I felt bad. So do you deal with cases like that? And how do you deal with such cases?

Thembeka Plenis: So far ndifumana i-support kakhulu kotitshala bam, otitshala besikolo sam…{IsiXhosa} [I’m getting a lot of support from the teachers.] They are so supportive. Though sometimes you find out they don’t know much, you see. But the weeks go by and we are saying that this week is Rape Awareness Week. They support the event, they help me, they come to me and they say to me: “Where can we help, what is it we can do?” They are very interested in helping me. I didn’t find any negative teachers so far.

Jason Wessenaar: Diteboho ho Thembeka, le ho Siyayinqoba Support Group le lona mono mahaeng. {Sesotho} [Thanks to Thembeka, to the Siyayinqoba Support Group and to the viewers at home.]

Jason Wessenaar: Things we should remember are:

1. Schools need to create a supportive environment for HIV positive learners to disclose their status.
2. HIV positive learners are a key resource in responding to the AIDS epidemic.
3. AIDS Action Committees unite learners and teachers in the struggle against HIV.

We hope that you enjoyed the show and are feeling the Siyayinqoba spirit: that together we can Beat It! If you have any questions for the support group or for Dr Nombulelo Madala, our resident doctor, please contact us on the numbers on your screen now. Join us again next week in the Siyayinqoba Beat It! Support Group. Ho fihlela bekeng e tlang, {SeSotho} [Join us again and until next week,] stay healthy, stay positive.

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